Yesterday, Michael Spencer expressed some skepticism about what he would hear when Rick Warren asked Barack Obama and John McCain "The Jesus Question," as he had promised he would.

Well, he did. This is a transcript of the two candidates' responses:

First, to Obama.

RICK: THE FIRST ONE IS CHRISTIANITY. NOW YOU'VE MADE NO DOUBT ABOUT YOUR FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN TO YOU? WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO YOU TO TRUST IN CHRIST AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN ON A DAILY BASIS? I MEAN, WHAT DOES THAT REALLY LOOK LIKE?

OBAMA: AS A STARTING POINT, IT MEANS I BELIEVE IN THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED FOR MY SINS AND THAT I AM REDEEMED THROUGH HIM. THAT IS A SOURCE OF STRENGTH AND SUSTENANCE ON A DAILY BASIS. I KNOW THAT I DON'T WALK ALONE, AND I KNOW THAT IF I CAN GET MYSELF OUT OF THE WAY, THAT I CAN MAYBE CARRY OUT IN SOME SMALL WAY WHAT HE INTENDS. AND IT MEANS THAT THOSE SINS THAT I HAVE ON A FAIRLY REGULAR BASIS HOPEFULLY WILL BE WASHED AWAY.

BUT WHAT IT ALSO MEANS, I THINK, IS A SENSE OF OBLIGATION TO EMBRACE NOT JUST WORDS BUT THROUGH DEEDS THE EXPECTATIONS THAT GOD HAS FOR US. AND THAT MEANS THINKING ABOUT THE LEAST OF THESE. IT MEANS ACTING -- WELL, ACTING JUSTLY AND LOVING MERCY AND WALKING HUMBLY WITH OUR GOD. AND THAT, I THINK TRYING TO APPLY THOSE LESSONS ON A DAILY BASIS KNOWING THAT YOU ARE GOING TO FALL A LITTLE BIT SHORT EACH DAY AND KIND OF TRYING TO BE ABLE TO TAKE NOTE AND SAY, WELL, THAT DIDN'T QUITE WORK OUT THE WAY I THINK IT SHOULD HAVE BUT MAYBE I CAN GET A LITTLE BIT BETTER. IT GIVES ME THE CONFIDENCE TO TRY THINGS INCLUDING THINGS LIKE RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT.


And then, to McCain:

RICK: YOU'VE MADE NO DOUBT ABOUT THE FACT THAT YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN. YOU PUBLICLY SAY YOU ARE A FOLLOWER OF CHRIST. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN TO YOU AND HOW DOES FAITH WORK OUT IN YOUR LIFE ON A DAILY BASIS? WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO YOU?

MCCAIN: MEANS I'M SAVED AND FORGIVEN AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE WORLD. OUR FAITH ENCOMPASSES NOT JUST THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA BUT THE WORLD. CAN I TELL YOU ANOTHER STORY REAL QUICK?

RICK: SURE.

MCCAIN: VIETNAMESE KEPT US IN PRISON IN CONDITIONS OF SOLITARY CONFINEMENT FOR TWO OR THREE TO A CELL. THEY DID THAT BECAUSE THEY KNEW THEY COULD BREAK DOWN OUR RESISTANCE. ONE OF THE TECHNIQUES THAT THEY USED TO GET INFORMATION WAS TO TAKE ROPES AND TIE THEM AROUND YOUR BICEPS, PULL YOUR BICEPS BEHIND YOU, LOOP THE ROPE AROUND YOUR HEAD, PULL YOUR HEAD DOWN BETWEEN YOUR KNEES AND LEAVE YOU IN THAT POSITION. YOU CAN IMAGINE, IT'S VERY UNCOMFORTABLE. ONE NIGHT I WAS BEING PUNISHED IN THAT FASHION. ALL OF A SUDDEN THE DOOR OF THE CELL OPENED, THE GUARD CAME IN, A GUY WHO WAS JUST WHAT WE CALL A GUN GUARD. HE JUST WALKED AROUND THE CAMP WITH A GUN ON HIS SHOULDER. HE WENT LIKE THIS AND THEN HE LOOSENED THE ROPES. HE CAME BACK ABOUT FOUR HOURS LATER, HE TIGHTENED THEM UP AGAIN AND LEFT. THE FOLLOWING CHRISTMAS, BECAUSE IT WAS CHRISTMAS DAY, WE WERE ALLOWED TO STAND OUTSIDE OF OUR CELL FOR A FEW MINUTES, AND THOSE DAYS WE WERE NOT ALLOWED TO SEE OR COMMUNICATE WITH EACH OTHER ALTHOUGH WE CERTAINLY DID. AND I WAS STANDING OUTSIDE FOR MY FEW MINUTES, OUTSIDE MY CELL. HE CAME WALKING UP. HE STOOD THERE FOR A MINUTE AND WITH HIS HANDLE ON THE DIRT IN THE COURTYARD HE DREW A CROSS AND HE STOOD THERE AND A MINUTE LATER, HE RUBBED IT OUT AND WALKED AWAY. FOR A MINUTE THERE, THERE WAS JUST TWO CHRISTIANS WORSHIPPING TOGETHER.

I'LL NEVER FORGET THAT MOMENT.

For both men, therefore, the first words that jump out of their mouths was that "I am forgiven," "I am redeemed," "He died for my sins," "I am saved."

That troubles me, especially when coming from a presidential candidate. Not because the idea is untrue. Far from it. It is gloriously true; a central tenet of the faith once delivered.

What troubles me is that it is the narrower aspect of the larger truth. I am saved, redeemed and forgiven because, in Jesus Christ, the world is redeemed, saved and forgiven, and I am part of that.

To be sure, both men touched on that aspect in different ways after their initial, gut-level response. Obama spoke of the responsibility that stems from that individual redemption. McCain said that that redemption extends to the whole world, "not just the United States." He then offered what I thought to be a lovely parable about Christ being found even in the midst of the greatest of hardships, even in the midst of the horrors of war.

But the first thing both said was telling. It is, I believe, the central and most critical (not error, but) incompleteness about sharing the good news of Jesus Christ in the world today. What God did in Christ was big, huge, cosmic. Reducing it to terms of "Jesus and me," while gravely important, cannot and should not be "the central message." If the gospel were a Russian doll, the "Jesus and me" bit would be one of the medium-sized dolls in the center.

Please God, may that grander vision sweep through your church, and may we begin to speak of Your redemption in the grandest of terms and the largest of contexts. May we begin to speak, at our first utterance, of Your plan and Your promise, inaugurated by Your Son, to fill all of creation with Your glory, with Your love, as the waters cover the sea. And may we begin to glimpse our vocation, given by grace and aided by Your Spirit, to by agents and ambassadors of that plan, that promise, that gospel.

Grace and Peace,
Raffi

P.S. By the way, if you missed any portion of the Saddleback Forum with the two candidates, Trevin has the whole thing in bite-sized YouTube clips at Kingdom People.